Ball joints

Texas Nick

Texas Nick

Caught the Bug
As the title states, i was wondering if anyone knew the torque specs on the upper and lower ball joint? Im about to start the replacing of them and hadnt found exact numbers.
Any help is greatly appreciated!
 
jesse3638

jesse3638

Hooked
Thread revival.

I noticed the other morning it seemed like I may be in the early stages of death wobble. After the NY19 run its to be expected...haha. My step son told me tonight that he was experiencing what he felt as speed wobbles and had to slow down to make it stop. Confirming my suspicions, I had him help me check the front end. I discovered the lower ball joint castle nut on the passenger side was loose. I could turn it with my fingers. The cotter pin was still there otherwise it'd have fallen off. Does it being this loose indicate the ball joints are going to need replacing soon? There are about 36k on them with 35's. Any other info as to what would cause this is much appreciated. For now I'm going to retorque all of them and see if this fixes it.

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fiend

fiend

Caught the Bug
I had loose castle nuts and it turned out the holes on my steering knuckles he ovalized. One was cracked. I had to replace them both. IMG_0328.jpg IMG_0890.JPG


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jesse3638

jesse3638

Hooked
fiend said:
I had loose castle nuts and it turned out the holes on my steering knuckles he ovalized. One was cracked. I had to replace them both. View attachment 319509 View attachment 319510


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Click to expand...
Yeah you're thread immediately came to mind. I retorqued it but it still is experiencing early death wobble. Hitting bumps between 40-45 will set it off. Also checked the track bar and it was still at 125. Guess I'm going to start some detective work. Did you have to pull the knuckles to see the ovaled out holes? Does 35k miles on OEM ball joints with 35's on wheel with 4" of back spacing seem like the ball joints could be going out?

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TrailHunter

TrailHunter

Hooked
jesse3638 said:
Thread revival.

I noticed the other morning it seemed like I may be in the early stages of death wobble. After the NY19 run its to be expected...haha. My step son told me tonight that he was experiencing what he felt as speed wobbles and had to slow down to make it stop. Confirming my suspicions, I had him help me check the front end. I discovered the lower ball joint castle nut on the passenger side was loose. I could turn it with my fingers. The cotter pin was still there otherwise it'd have fallen off. Does it being this loose indicate the ball joints are going to need replacing soon? There are about 36k on them with 35's. Any other info as to what would cause this is much appreciated. For now I'm going to retorque all of them and see if this fixes it.

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Click to expand...

Are you still on the Factory Ball Joints?
 
Texas Nick

Texas Nick

Caught the Bug
My factory ball joints went out at 15k. That was with the stock rubicon tires too. So I wouldn’t doubt that’s what needs replacing.
 
fiend

fiend

Caught the Bug
jesse3638 said:
Yeah you're thread immediately came to mind. I retorqued it but it still is experiencing early death wobble. Hitting bumps between 40-45 will set it off. Also checked the track bar and it was still at 125. Guess I'm going to start some detective work. Did you have to pull the knuckles to see the ovaled out holes? Does 35k miles on OEM ball joints with 35's on wheel with 4" of back spacing seem like the ball joints could be going out?

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Click to expand...

Both my knuckles were bad and one was cracked, but I had no death wobble.

I noticed the crack in one just by looking at it. The other I didn’t catch until I removed the knuckle.

IMG_0325.jpg

It’s definitely possible your stock ball joints are done at 35k and less than stock back spacing. Stock stuff just isn’t designed for oversized tires, minimal backspacing, and hard wheeling. Things wear out and need to be replaced much sooner.


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USMC Wrangler

USMC Wrangler

New member
I ran my stock ball joints for 72,130 miles and the lowers were definitely shot last weekend when I removed them. They’ve probably been bad since I added 35’s and 4.5” backspace wheels about 40k miles ago. I checked them regularly by jacking the front end up and prying up on the tire. I could never eyeball any movement and never had death wobble. I did have a slight, strange pull that I attributed to radial pull with the Nittos. That pull is completely gone, except windy days, with the ProSteers.
 
WJCO

WJCO

Meme King
jesse3638 said:
I discovered the lower ball joint castle nut on the passenger side was loose. I could turn it with my fingers. The cotter pin was still there otherwise it'd have fallen off. Does it being this loose indicate the ball joints are going to need replacing soon?
Click to expand...

Keep us posted on this. Ours is doing the same thing. RF lower nut actually fell off. We had no symptoms at all, I luckily check unit bearings for play during every tire rotation and about a month ago it was crazy loose, that's when I discovered the missing lower ball joint nut. Luckily I had an old one in my collection of fasteners. I marked it with paint along with the driver's side. A few days later, it was obvious that the RF lower nut had moved whereas the LF hadn't moved at all. I still can't figure out how the nut came all the way off. I did the ball joints last year but I can't imagine I'd forget to put a cotter pin in. I've been keeping an eye on it at least twice a week. Curious to see if you find out something that may be causing it.
 
jesse3638

jesse3638

Hooked
WJCO said:
Keep us posted on this. Ours is doing the same thing. RF lower nut actually fell off. We had no symptoms at all, I luckily check unit bearings for play during every tire rotation and about a month ago it was crazy loose, that's when I discovered the missing lower ball joint nut. Luckily I had an old one in my collection of fasteners. I marked it with paint along with the driver's side. A few days later, it was obvious that the RF lower nut had moved whereas the LF hadn't moved at all. I still can't figure out how the nut came all the way off. I did the ball joints last year but I can't imagine I'd forget to put a cotter pin in. I've been keeping an eye on it at least twice a week. Curious to see if you find out something that may be causing it.
Click to expand...
I was completely surprised to find it so loose. I plan on pulling it into the drive way today and going over the whole front end. It was 8pm when I found it last night and was hoping retorquing it would solve it so my step son could drive it to school today. I need to check unit bearings too. Maybe I'll just do unit bearings and ball joints every 36k miles...haha. I was planning on prosteers but after hearing about how much of a PIA they are to rebuild I'll probably look at Crown or Oreilly. With selling the house I was thinking I may be able to do a PR44 when I get new tires and regear the rear in a few months, so I'm not wanting to invest a ton of money.

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fiend

fiend

Caught the Bug
The part that wears out in the ball joints is the socket in which the ball sits. That has nothing to do with the tapered part that fits into the knuckle with an interference fit. If your castle nuts won’t stay tight, the interference fit is compromised, most likely because the tapered hole in the knuckle has widened and/or ovalized. New ball joints aren’t going to solve that problem. You’ll need new knuckles.


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Last edited:
rubiDave

rubiDave

Active Member
fiend said:
The part that wears out in the ball joints is the socket in which the ball sits. That has nothing to do with the tapered part that fits into the knuckle with an interference fit. If your castle nuts won’t stay tight, the interference fit is compromised, most likely because the tapered hole in the knuckle has widened and/or ovalized. New ball joints aren’t going to solve that problem. You’ll need new knuckles.


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That's what I was thinking. Unless it wasn't assembled right in the first place. I think I would torque it to spec and check for ball joint play.

Your failed knuckle was crazy. I wouldn't think that would be a common occurance.

I have a ball joint that is going out. It has had about 0.040" play since an incident last October. It hasn't gotten any worse and I only notice a slight shimmy once and a while so I have been lax in addressing it. My knuckle doesn't look damaged and the castle juts are still tight.

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jesse3638

jesse3638

Hooked
fiend said:
The part that wears out in the ball joints is the socket in which the ball sits. That has nothing to do with the tapered part that fits into the knuckle with an interference fit. If your castle nuts won’t stay tight, the interference fit is compromised, most likely because the tapered hole in the knuckle has widened and/or ovalized. New ball joints aren’t going to solve that problem. You’ll need new knuckles.


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Yeah that's what I was thinking. I was really surprised to see it so loose and the cotter pin still in it.

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fiend

fiend

Caught the Bug
jesse3638 said:
Yeah that's what I was thinking. I was really surprised to see it so loose and the cotter pin still in it.

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Click to expand...

My passenger side knuckle had the same thing: loose castle nut. I tightened it up and drove the Jeep for a few weeks until I removed the knuckle and found the hole had ovalized. Now replacing with Ranchos, which has led to a different set of complications I’m working through.


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WJCO

WJCO

Meme King
fiend said:
Now replacing with Ranchos, which has led to a different set of complications I’m working through.
Click to expand...

What's going on with those? Something directly related to the knuckles? I have the same ones with no issues so far.
 
fiend

fiend

Caught the Bug
WJCO said:
What's going on with those? Something directly related to the knuckles? I have the same ones with no issues so far.
Click to expand...

They raise the tie rod 1.5”. I have a Currie tie rod, which is oversized (1 5/8”). I also have a Prorock44, which has a thick cover that sticks out a ways. The raised tie rod is now at the same level as the part of the diff cover that protrudes the furthest. So full steering lock to the left has the tie rod hitting the diff cover before the steering stops contact. I could drill and tap the stops and stick in bolts, but my steering radius is going to be huge and probably unacceptable. I’m noodling solutions now, but may have to ditch the Rancho knuckles and go back to OEM. We’ll see.


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