Eating Crow

'ol Blue · Apr 19, 2016

A couple of months ago when shopping for a winch for my 2015 JKUR I drank the cool aid and settled on a smittybilt x20 10k winch with synthetic line. At the time of purchasing my wife said you should get a Warn. Well I reasoned why spend almost twice the price for a winch. Warn can't be the only good winch right?

Well Sunday we were up hwy 4 here in California and we were trail riding some forest roads looking for some trouble to get into and alas we found some snow. DEEP snow. We hit it hard but about halfway through we were done bottomed out on the frame.

No problem right we got a winch right. WRONG! My son runs out the synthetic winch line sweet my nine year old can handle to line awesome. We hook up to a sturdy tree get in the jeep get the tires rolling click remote in and nothing. Winch spinning but we aren't moving.

I get out the winch line spinning on the drum. Well crap. When installing this line I wound it on under tension With the jeep on a small hill yet when we went to use it the end of the rope ripped the head off of the bolt that holds the wire to the drum.

I quickly emailed smittybilt Sunday afternoon and have yet to hear from them so as I am now ordering my new Warn Zeon 10-s this afternoon all I can hear is my wife say "I told you so". Lesson learned and I hope my experience might help someone else.

Oh yeah after two hours of trying to dig it out with shovels we resorted to walking back to the main road. An hour worth of walking we ran into three Jeeps that came to our rescue. They had Warn's. The Jeeping community is great and we are proud to be apart of it. Next time maybe it will be us helping someone with the unfortunate luck we suffered from this weekend.

Speedy_RCW · Apr 19, 2016

'ol Blue said:
A couple of months ago when shopping for a winch for my 2015 JKUR I drank the cool aid and settled on a smittybilt x20 10k winch with synthetic line. At the time of purchasing my wife said you should get a Warn. Well I reasoned why spend almost twice the price for a winch. Warn can't be the only good winch right?

Well Sunday we were up hwy 4 here in California and we were trail riding some forest roads looking for some trouble to get into and alas we found some snow. DEEP snow. We hit it hard but about halfway through we were done bottomed out on the frame.

No problem right we got a winch right. WRONG! My son runs out the synthetic winch line sweet my nine year old can handle to line awesome. We hook up to a sturdy tree get in the jeep get the tires rolling click remote in and nothing. Winch spinning but we aren't moving.

I get out the winch line spinning on the drum. Well crap. When installing this line I wound it on under tension With the jeep on a small hill yet when we went to use it the end of the rope ripped the head off of the bolt that holds the wire to the drum.

I quickly emailed smittybilt Sunday afternoon and have yet to hear from them so as I am now ordering my new Warn Zeon 10-s this afternoon all I can hear is my wife say "I told you so". Lesson learned and I hope my experience might help someone else.

Oh yeah after two hours of trying to dig it out with shovels we resorted to walking back to the main road. An hour worth of walking we ran into three Jeeps that came to our rescue. They had Warn's. The Jeeping community is great and we are proud to be apart of it. Next time maybe it will be us helping someone with the unfortunate luck we suffered from this weekend.

Hate to say it but this doesn't sound like a Smittybilt problem. It sounds like you spooled out too much rope. The bolt which anchors the end of the rope to the spool is not there to handle the weight of your Jeep. Sounds like you would have this problem regardless of what winch you were running.

'ol Blue · Apr 19, 2016

Speedy_RCW said:
Hate to say it but this doesn't sound like a Smittybilt problem. It sounds like you spooled out too much rope. The bolt which anchors the end of the rope to the spool is not there to handle the weight of your Jeep. Sounds like you would have this problem regardless of what winch you were running.

I wish this were the problem but I had less than 50' of the 100' of rope out. However Warn's way of attaching the rope is far superior to smittybilts small bolt at the end of the rope.

Speedy_RCW · Apr 19, 2016

'ol Blue said:
I wish this were the problem but I had less than 50' of the 100' of rope out. However Warn's way of attaching the rope is far superior to smittybilts small bolt at the end of the rope.

I agree with that. But you shouldn't have 50ft of rope slipping on the spool. The subsequent wraps should be cinching down and there really shouldn't be any tension on the anchor to the drum.

'ol Blue · Apr 19, 2016

Speedy_RCW said:
I agree with that. But you shouldn't have 50ft of rope slipping on the spool. The subsequent wraps should be cinching down and there really shouldn't be any tension on the anchor to the drum.

I would agree with that. This is the first winch that I have had with synthetic line but the drum was well covered in this picture if I can get it attached shows the first pull the end of the rope pulled out of crimp. We unspooled it opened crimp and recrimped on rope reattached and wound back up and the

ImageUploadedByWAYALIFE1461046175.963291.jpg

n the bolt sheared. I do not have a picture of the sheared bolt on the phone right now. But perhaps I am mistaken and need much more line on the drum but as you see in the picture there is at least a double tap and it went all the way across the drum. Perhaps I am doing it wrong. We can alway learn.

Journeyman · Apr 19, 2016

Three wraps should have some pressure on the pin. Five wraps should be almost none. 50' wrapped on the drum would not be relying on the attachment point to the drum.

Speedy_RCW · Apr 19, 2016

'ol Blue said:
I would agree with that. This is the first winch that I have had with synthetic line but the drum was well covered in this picture if I can get it attached shows the first pull the end of the rope pulled out of crimp. We unspooled it opened crimp and recrimped on rope reattached and wound back up and the View attachment 199286 n the bolt sheared. I do not have a picture of the sheared bolt on the phone right now. But perhaps I am mistaken and need much more line on the drum but as you see in the picture there is at least a double tap and it went all the way across the drum. Perhaps I am doing it wrong. We can alway learn.

I'm not sure what you mean by a double tap but there shouldn't have to be a whole hell of a lot of line on there. The bolt that anchors the line to the drum is tiny, less than 1/4" if I remember right. It would be much larger and the line wouldn't crimp in to that lug if it was ever designed to hold up to 10k pounds pulling power. It sounds like your line was just not properly stretched and spooled. But hey, you got a Warn on the way now. And for the record, you should never talk your wife out of letting you but the more expensive Jeel parts. :thumb:

'ol Blue · Apr 19, 2016

With cable I was told if it covered the drum you were good however this is my first synthetic line does it need more line on the drum? I'm second guessing myself now. If I can only use half of the 100' line that kinda sucks.

Speedy_RCW · Apr 19, 2016

'ol Blue said:
With cable I was told if it covered the drum you were good however this is my first synthetic line does it need more line on the drum? I'm second guessing myself now. If I can only use half of the 100' line that kinda sucks.

Journeyman above pretty much nailed it. I think Smittybilt says to keep at least 5 wraps on the drum. But again, you need to have the line properly spooled. If it's all loose on the drum you can run into the problem you described.

'ol Blue · Apr 19, 2016

Speedy_RCW said:
Journeyman above pretty much nailed it. I think Smittybilt says to keep at least 5 wraps on the drum. But again, you need to have the line properly spooled. If it's all loose on the drum you can run into the problem you described.

Okay so when we installed the line on the drum we winched the first layer one the drum and then put in under tension from the Jeep on the only hill I could find in town and we wished it in. I assuming that was not the proper way to do it. So what is the best way? Always learning.

Speedy_RCW · Apr 19, 2016

'ol Blue said:
Okay so when we installed the line on the drum we winched the first layer one the drum and then put in under tension from the Jeep on the only hill I could find in town and we wished it in. I assuming that was not the proper way to do it. So what is the best way? Always learning.

I personally ran the first five or so wraps on by hand, then I hooked up to an anchor point (happened to be a Gradall at work) and set the e-brake a couple clicks and winched in. Every few wraps I'd set the brake hard and stretch the shit out of the line. Then go back to a couple clicks on the brake, then repeat. I've never had any issues with line slipping on the drum. After each run where I've winched or at least every month or so I pull out the rope and re-spool nice and tight using an anchor point and resistance of some sort. But I'm sure everyone kinda has their own routine. You just want to make sure new rope is stretched and spooled tight. At least that's my opinion.

'ol Blue · Apr 19, 2016

Speedy_RCW said:
I personally ran the first five or so wraps on by hand, then I hooked up to an anchor point (happened to be a Gradall at work) and set the e-brake a couple clicks and winched in. Every few wraps I'd set the brake hard and stretch the shit out of the line. Then go back to a couple clicks on the brake, then repeat. I've never had any issues with line slipping on the drum. After each run where I've winched or at least every month or so I pull out the rope and re-spool nice and tight using an anchor point and resistance of some sort. But I'm sure everyone kinda has their own routine. You just want to make sure new rope is stretched and spooled tight. At least that's my opinion.

Well I appreciate all the knowledge for very quick response. Although I still think I will be more comfortable with the new Warn in the front when out with my family. It's going to take a few days to rest my ears after the chewing I got on that long walk back to find someone.

Speedy_RCW · Apr 19, 2016

'ol Blue said:
Well I appreciate all the knowledge for very quick response. Although I still think I will be more comfortable with the new Warn in the front when out with my family. It's going to take a few days to rest my ears after the chewing I got on that long walk back to find someone.

Haha, yea that sucks man. Sorry to hear it. Put your X2O up on Craigslist to offset the Warn cost. And just make sure you get a good stretch on the new winch line. It will also keep the top layers from slipping under the bottom ones or worse, damaging your line all together. Let us know how everything works out for you.

'ol Blue · Apr 19, 2016

Speedy_RCW said:
Haha, yea that sucks man. Sorry to hear it. Put your X2O up on Craigslist to offset the Warn cost. And just make sure you get a good stretch on the new winch line. It will also keep the top layers from slipping under the bottom ones or worse, damaging your line all together. Let us know how everything works out for you.

Will do. I may just drill and tap the drum on the x20 reinstall new line and put it on the yota it doesn't see much trouble but has done its fair share of yanking people out of snow banks.

2nd.gunman · Apr 19, 2016

'ol Blue said:
I wish this were the problem but I had less than 50' of the 100' of rope out. However Warn's way of attaching the rope is far superior to smittybilts small bolt at the end of the rope.

A lot of Warn winches use the exact same attachment bolt. The only way what you described could happen is if the rope wasn't tight on the drum. It could be just be that the rope has stretched and settled then when running the line out it slipped on the drum.

I've heard of some new ropes needing to be re spooled several times before being fully stretched.

Anyway you'll feel much more comfortable with the Warn on the front than the shittybuilt [emoji106]

OverlanderJK · Apr 19, 2016

I can't see this being a smittybilt problem. Sounds like you did something wrong installing the line or when trying to use the winch. If the drum is spinning it should be pulling.

HighwayTrout · Apr 19, 2016

Sounds like you want a Warn and now doing anything to justify the purchase.

Right on.

Journeyman · Apr 19, 2016

If you put the entire first layer on by hand. That's the problem. Having that loose layer underneath all your tight layers will cause that layer to bunch up and I've actually heard of this action cutting the line.

WJCO · Apr 19, 2016

'ol Blue said:
With cable I was told if it covered the drum you were good however this is my first synthetic line does it need more line on the drum? I'm second guessing myself now. If I can only use half of the 100' line that kinda sucks.

Congrats on the new Warn winch coming. Wise decision.

FYI, When I first used my Zeon to stretch the rope, I anchored to another vehicle. I only had 5 wraps on the drum (that I had put on by hand) and it winched fine to get the rope stretched. Not sure what happened in your case. For that anchor bolt to have snapped, there had to be some kind of load on the bolt and there shouldn't be. Also I assume you spooled the rope on from the bottom under the drum correct?

Speeddmn · Apr 19, 2016

So my story is close, but 180 degrees out. My wife wanted to go cheap and bought a XRC8 Shitbuilt. I dragged the cable out, attached it to my pickup and then got it snug up on the drum. Fast forward a few months/a year whatever and I went to use it. Well I was attached to a small tree (like 4 inches in diameter, 10 foot tall) I dug around said tree cut the roots etc. I attached the winch line to it and began pulling. I snapped the housing of the winch where the bolts attach it to the bumper..

I removed it all and threw it in the trash.

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