Continuing to T/S Steering Vibration

M

MDK210

New member
Background; I have a slight steering wheel shake from 45-55mph. My lift/wheels were put on the same day utilizing my stock 32" BFG KM tires w/14K miles and I didn't notice any issues but I drove less than 50 miles on them before I got new 35"s. My new tires are the Firestone M/T 2 and that's when I really noticed the steering wheel shake. I've had them static balanced twice by two different installers including the off-road shop I had my lift/wheels installed at. Yesterday I had them road force balanced at the place I purchased the tires, they found some issues and adjusted accordingly but it still did it.

One of the tire techs drove it with me after the road force balance and said it could be a front driveshaft issue. Well, I just had my new front/rear shafts installed today and with that came another alignment check but the vibration still happens. We had to install some rear upper control arms to fix the pinion angle for the new rear shaft but other than that the alignment was on point. I had the manager from the off-road shop ride with me and he said it was a tire issue for sure seeing as we just did the shafts. I called the tire dealer today to ask what the next step was and before we can swap out or refund anything they have to do their own check up tomorrow so that's next up.

The internet/forum consensus is at that mph range it's definitely a tire issue. I was told by the tire shop manager I could try getting the vehicle up to the speed where the problem occurs, put the trans in neutral to limit some front shaft strain, and see if the vibration still occurs...it does. So what else is there? My stock 32" mud terrains never had an issue so is it because these are 35"s with a much more aggressive tread? I've run my tire pressure from 26-35psi and it's always the same issue in the same mph range. Am I missing something?
 
Speedy_RCW

Speedy_RCW

Hooked
MDK210 said:
Background; I have a slight steering wheel shake from 45-55mph. My lift/wheels were put on the same day utilizing my stock 32" BFG KM tires w/14K miles and I didn't notice any issues but I drove less than 50 miles on them before I got new 35"s. My new tires are the Firestone M/T 2 and that's when I really noticed the steering wheel shake. I've had them static balanced twice by two different installers including the off-road shop I had my lift/wheels installed at. Yesterday I had them road force balanced at the place I purchased the tires, they found some issues and adjusted accordingly but it still did it.

One of the tire techs drove it with me after the road force balance and said it could be a front driveshaft issue. Well, I just had my new front/rear shafts installed today and with that came another alignment check but the vibration still happens. We had to install some rear upper control arms to fix the pinion angle for the new rear shaft but other than that the alignment was on point. I had the manager from the off-road shop ride with me and he said it was a tire issue for sure seeing as we just did the shafts. I called the tire dealer today to ask what the next step was and before we can swap out or refund anything they have to do their own check up tomorrow so that's next up.

The internet/forum consensus is at that mph range it's definitely a tire issue. I was told by the tire shop manager I could try getting the vehicle up to the speed where the problem occurs, put the trans in neutral to limit some front shaft strain, and see if the vibration still occurs...it does. So what else is there? My stock 32" mud terrains never had an issue so is it because these are 35"s with a much more aggressive tread? I've run my tire pressure from 26-35psi and it's always the same issue in the same mph range. Am I missing something?
Click to expand...

Have you rotated the tires around to see if it changes? I highly doubt a steering wheel shake would be caused by a driveshaft. It’s more than likely tire related. Move them front to back and see if that makes a difference. If you want to rule out driveshafts, remove them one at a time as well and take it for a spin.


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M

MDK210

New member
Speedy_RCW said:
Have you rotated the tires around to see if it changes? I highly doubt a steering wheel shake would be caused by a driveshaft. It’s more than likely tire related. Move them front to back and see if that makes a difference. If you want to rule out driveshafts, remove them one at a time as well and take it for a spin.


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Click to expand...

They rotated one to the rear after the road force balance. Didn't think about removing the driveshaft but I'll let them do that if they feel the need. They have to prove to me it's not the tires at this point.
 
Speedy_RCW

Speedy_RCW

Hooked
MDK210 said:
They rotated one to the rear after the road force balance. Didn't think about removing the driveshaft but I'll let them do that if they feel the need. They have to prove to me it's not the tires at this point.
Click to expand...

Last time I checked there’s two tires on the front of Jeeps. Could be either or both.


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WJCO

WJCO

Meme King
Being that you did the neutral test, it's likely not drive train related. It could be a bad tire, and balancing won't help. Could also be wheel bearings, ball joints, or loose steering linkage and the larger tires made it more noticeable.
 
jorgelrod

jorgelrod

Hooked
I have this happen ocassionally when I rotate my tires and I just have them rebalanced and that fixes it. I think as the tires wear out, the weight from balancing goes off or something I guess.
 
M

MDK210

New member
Thanks for all the advice. I did a quick check on the front end suspension components and everything seemed good. Took it in and had their mechanics take a look as well and everything appears good to them.

They are saying it's the tires themselves and instead of replacing the M/T's with a new set we are going to switch to a different brand and A/T's next week so we'll see what happens.

A/T's are 10lbs lighter than my current tire so that's awesome for my suspension, mpg, and factory tire carrier ha.
 
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M

MDK210

New member
Update for anyone who may be Google'ing this issue or other interested parties;

- The original Firestone M/T 2 tires were found to be "defective" by the Firestone dealer but I don't believe they actually checked anything. Even though there's a 30 day buy and try guarantee on Firestone/Bridgestone tires the dealer said they had to go through a formal inspection of my vehicle which sounded odd but they didn't find anything as expected.

- A set of Bridgestone Revo 3's were ordered which are also a new release but an AT instead of MT. It took almost two weeks due to backorder and logistical issues but I had them installed and still had the same issue. I took a look at the wheel weights and noticed they had over 40 1/4oz weights on each wheel! They were double stacked weights and all over the damn wheel which after much research watching Hunter balancer videos is not the right way. It really feels like the dealer is not experienced with balancing anything bigger than a passenger tire.

- I went back to the 4 Wheel store thinking after two different brands/types of tires it had to be suspension so I was ready to buy the store. The manager called me into the back a few minutes after having the Jeep and showed me how the tire was causing the balancer to chase weights. It asked for 6oz, respun, asked for more, respun, and asked for more! The store had a deal on 37's so I asked to see one mounted just to make sure it wasn't the wheels and sure enough my old 35" tires that were out of balance with over 10oz of weights appears to be the culprit because the new 37's took only 3oz on each wheel and were balanced after one spin! A bigger tire should be harder to balance and while I have a very minor shake still it's about 95% so what a difference.

I called the Firestone dealer and told them my findings and they wanted me to go through the same process all over again with these tires but I called BS and rang the Bridgestone warranty section directly. They said, just as their guarantee does, that if the customer isn't happy with any aspect of the tire within 30 days you can take them back for a full refund. I still find it hard to believe I ran through two brands of tires with one being MTs and the other ATs and got the same results. Both tires came out this year so I'm not sure what to think.
 
M

MDK210

New member
*UPDATE*
Got tired of the mild steering shake still so I spoke with one of the Discount Tire manager's here in Colorado Springs and I explained they will be the 3rd company to try and balance the shake out. He stated he would assign his best tech and do his best using the road force balancer. I went in first thing this morning, he said they just got done calibrating the system and it was ready for my tires. Got the tires back and print out of the RF balancer and the tech/manager said they were all great on runout especially being a 37" tire so there was no need to rim match apparently. The heaviest tire was balanced at 4oz and was put from the front left to right rear...BUT I STILL HAVE THE SAME PROBLEM!

I'm really close to replacing the track bar, tie rod, and adding a flipped drag link but I just don't think it should take all this on a 15K mile vehicle with light offroad use. My front/rear trackbar is only off 1/2in and bolts are torqued to 125ft lbs so I doubt that wil fix it, nothing appears to be wrong with the tie rod or stock drag link according to the 4 wheel store. So with that being said the only thing else I could even think of is ball joints but why ball joints would only act up from 55-60mph makes no sense.

What else could be the culprit?
 
J

JKDream

Guest
MDK210 said:
*UPDATE*
Got tired of the mild steering shake still so I spoke with one of the Discount Tire manager's here in Colorado Springs and I explained they will be the 3rd company to try and balance the shake out. He stated he would assign his best tech and do his best using the road force balancer. I went in first thing this morning, he said they just got done calibrating the system and it was ready for my tires. Got the tires back and print out of the RF balancer and the tech/manager said they were all great on runout especially being a 37" tire so there was no need to rim match apparently. The heaviest tire was balanced at 4oz and was put from the front left to right rear...BUT I STILL HAVE THE SAME PROBLEM!

I'm really close to replacing the track bar, tie rod, and adding a flipped drag link but I just don't think it should take all this on a 15K mile vehicle with light offroad use. My front/rear trackbar is only off 1/2in and bolts are torqued to 125ft lbs so I doubt that wil fix it, nothing appears to be wrong with the tie rod or stock drag link according to the 4 wheel store. So with that being said the only thing else I could even think of is ball joints but why ball joints would only act up from 55-60mph makes no sense.

What else could be the culprit?
Click to expand...
It's probably just the tires man. Some tires don't balance, Goodyear MTR are a great example of that. I wouldn't buy mud tires from a company that really doesn't specialize in them.

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M

MDK210

New member
JKDream said:
It's probably just the tires man. Some tires don't balance, Goodyear MTR are a great example of that. I wouldn't buy mud tires from a company that really doesn't specialize in them.

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Click to expand...

I hear ya, it's just frustrating to think I've go through 3 different brands of tires, 2 different sized tires, and 2 different tread types but they all have the same issue at the same range.
 
Bierpower

Bierpower

Hooked
This is just a shot in the dark but we used to get super duty's in the shop that had a steering wheel shimmy. We always checked the front axle u-joints. The u-joints would seize and when the wheel wasn't perfectly straight it would send feedback to the steering wheel. If you lift the front tires off of the ground and turn them, you can spin the tire and tell immediately if a u-joints is hanging up. At 15k it's unlikely but worth a shot.

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fiend

fiend

Caught the Bug
I doubt you had three sets of defective tires. Maybe it’s your wheels not the tires that are out of balance or have a defect of some sort. I bought a used car one time that had a vibration that become more noticeable at certain speed ranges. I took it in for an alignment and wheel balance, and the shop discovered that two of the wheels had flat spots, probably caused by hard hits driving over pot holes. The wheels would balance ok on the machine, but the flat spots would cause vibrations. See if you can borrow a different set of wheels to try out.
 
M

MDK210

New member
fiend said:
I doubt you had three sets of defective tires. Maybe it’s your wheels not the tires that are out of balance or have a defect of some sort. I bought a used car one time that had a vibration that become more noticeable at certain speed ranges. I took it in for an alignment and wheel balance, and the shop discovered that two of the wheels had flat spots, probably caused by hard hits driving over pot holes. The wheels would balance ok on the machine, but the flat spots would cause vibrations. See if you can borrow a different set of wheels to try out.
Click to expand...

Yeah the only thing we haven’t tried is new wheels since technically these are already new wheels but we’ve been relying on the Road Force machines to tell us if the rim is bad and it doesn’t even hint at a bad wheel. I’m not losing tire pressure so that’s a plus. I think my buddy is leaving his Jeep with me for the next couple of months starting next week and we have similar tires/wheels so I’ll swap the fronts and try it. This is all such a PITA btw...
 
M

MDK210

New member
*UPDATE*

Tried different wheels/tires and nothing changed. Took it to Jeep and they said the only thing they noticed was a little dead spot in the stock stabilizer so they replaced it but that didn’t make a difference. The dealer said I might want to try a bigger stabilizer and against my better judgment I bought one from OME and shocker...didn’t work. Took it to the last off road store in the city who claims to be hot shit and they did an inspection. Find out my tires were out of balance (5 places so far have said that) and saw some flex in the trackbar (common for stock) and the draglink bushings a little worn (questionable at 15K miles). So against my better judgment, again, I got a new trackbar and draglink on it yesterday...didn’t work and when they balanced my tires the dude added a clipon weight. An off-road company using clipon weights??????

So to summarize;
- I’ve had the tires balanced at 5 different places and multiple times from dynamic to road force. Everyone claims the last guy didn’t balance them right. Apparently nobody in my town can balance tires ha.
- Tried 3 different tire brands, two different types/sizes
- Tried different wheels
- Installed trackbar and draglink flip
- Installed new steering stabilizer
- Had two off-road shops, one general mechanic shop, and our “fanciest” Jeep dealer here look at it.

I’m truly at a loss for words and the fact my buddies Jeep that’s in my garage right now has almost the same setup but on a 2011 and it has no wobble. W...T...F
 
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