Toyo Tire Weight = Power Hit?

Jacalore

New member
Waiting for lift kit to arrive, have Toyo 305x12.5R17 in the garage. Love everything I've read about Toyo Open Country AT2 except the weight. At 64 lbs each, they're almost 2x the weight of stock tires. I'm thinking this is going to be a noticeable hit, power wise. Significant?
 

wayoflife

Administrator
Staff member
Weight will NOT rob you of power. Size will. Regear and you will be able to regain the power you lost. With 305 measure up to what an advertised 35" tire is and so you'll want to run what is appropriate for them. 4.56 will bring you back up to stock performance but I would recommend 4.88 as that will give you a bit more.
 

Jacalore

New member
Weight will NOT rob you of power. Size will. Regear and you will be able to regain the power you lost. With 305 measure up to what an advertised 35" tire is and so you'll want to run what is appropriate for them. 4.56 will bring you back up to stock performance but I would recommend 4.88 as that will give you a bit more.
Thanks for the advice.
What does this regearing involve?
 

wayoflife

Administrator
Staff member
Thanks for the advice.
What does this regearing involve?

You'll need to take your Jeep to a shop that can install ring & pinions. They will take apart your axles and install new ones with the ratio that you are wanting. Depending on where you live, this can cost anywhere between $1,000 - $2,000. If you don't already have lockers, this might be a good time to consider them as you will only be paying for labor once.
 

Sharkey

Word Ninja
And you will need a procal or something similar to "tell" your vehicle that it is running different gears.
 
J

JKDream

Guest
And you will need a procal or something similar to "tell" your vehicle that it is running different gears.

But only mandatory for automatics.
Manuals don't NEED one to drive, just to update the speedo.
 

Jacalore

New member
Thanks everyone for the feedback and info. Regearing is an expensive mod, I'll have to see what the new wheels feel like... scheduled to be installed Tue this week.

How do you measure the gain regearing gives you, in hp or torque?
 
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JeepJeep75

New member
Thanks everyone for the feedback and info. Regearing is an expensive mod, I'll have to see what the new wheels feel like... scheduled to be installed Tue this week.

How do you measure the gain regearing gives you, in hp or torque?

The ol' butt-dyno!! Seriously though, the engine is still making the same power it always has. When you put on bigger tires, the engine has to move the jeep with a "smaller pry-bar". Changing the gears makes that pry-bar bigger. Get it? Same guy on the end of the pry-bar (your engine), but when you regear the prybar is bigger. Now that same guy can move a bigger load.


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Sharkey

Word Ninja
The ol' butt-dyno!! Seriously though, the engine is still making the same power it always has. When you put on bigger tires, the engine has to move the jeep with a "smaller pry-bar". Changing the gears makes that pry-bar bigger. Get it? Same guy on the end of the pry-bar (your engine), but when you regear the prybar is bigger. Now that same guy can move a bigger load.


Sent from my iPhone using WAYALIFE mobile app

Ha! Perfect description!
 

Apdski

New member
Regear is up next on my to do list. I've lost 6th gear with only 33s. Just out of curiosity, what does the weight of the tire affect. It has to have some drain on power...I.e takes more energy/power to get the heavier tire rolling? Or am I thinking to far into it
 

JeepJeep75

New member
Regear is up next on my to do list. I've lost 6th gear with only 33s. Just out of curiosity, what does the weight of the tire affect. It has to have some drain on power...I.e takes more energy/power to get the heavier tire rolling? Or am I thinking to far into it

More weight is more weight. It takes more power and more brakes to start and stop more weight. Tires are part of the weight package of the jeep. Now, if your talking about spinning up those heavier tires and stopping them, ya, they are gonna put more strain on the power train when your gaining and loosing traction off-road, but for daily driving it's just a heavier total package that is gonna be noticeable.


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Cummins_Powered

New member
:sigh: The weight difference is NOT as much as the OP mentioned. Factory tires weigh about 50 lbs. The tires he wants are only 15 lbs. more a piece. Hardly enough to make a difference. You put a fat guy in your race car that weigh 60 lbs more than a skinny guy and the car will have the same performance issues. BTW, we drive Jeeps and typically, unsprung weight isn't always a bad thing :naw:


Just to throw this out there, it is generally accepted that 1lb of rotational mass is equivalent to 2lbs of static weight. For a jeep though...yea unsprung doesnt really matter as much.
 

toyotire

New member
Everybody has a different tolerance for whether the power loss is going to drive them nuts or not. Some people are happy running 35's with 3.21 gears while others are not happy running stock tires with 4.10's. slap them on and decide how they feel. One thing is after you get them make sure you don't run around with 40psi in them or you will complain of a rough ride. air those puppies down to 28psi or so.
 

Apdski

New member
Just to throw this out there, it is generally accepted that 1lb of rotational mass is equivalent to 2lbs of static weight. For a jeep though...yea unsprung doesnt really matter as much.

Don't remember who told me or where I read it but I had the impression 1lb of rotational mass equaled 10lbs of static load. Which if you go from stock tires to say a 60-65lb tire you were "adding 400lbs plus of ""cargo"". Seemed like large affect but I never looking into it any further. Not that it really matters, I just like to know stuff. I shall do more research.
 

Jacalore

New member
Everybody has a different tolerance for whether the power loss is going to drive them nuts or not. Some people are happy running 35's with 3.21 gears while others are not happy running stock tires with 4.10's. slap them on and decide how they feel. One thing is after you get them make sure you don't run around with 40psi in them or you will complain of a rough ride. air those puppies down to 28psi or so.
Yeah, agree, we'll see very shortly. I'm hoping the difference is not great, not unlike driving with the added weight of a passenger. 28 psi it is!

I'll have to experiment airing down for the beach. I'll start at 18 psi, as it's where I ran the stock wheels. Thanks all y'all for the education!
 

wayoflife

Administrator
Staff member
If you get on a 10-speed bike, put it in the tallest gear and try to pedal forward from a stop, you will find it quite difficult to do or at least until you get going. Drop it down to the smallest gear and you'll find it to be a lot easier. This is called gear reduction and there's a reason why your ring and pinion comes in a ratio like 3.73 to 1. That is, your drive shaft has to spin 3.73 times to rotate your tires once. Your tires are effectively another gear that needs to be turned and the larger the diameter, the more work it will take to turn them, just like on a bike. While weight will have some effect on your engine's ability to turn your tires, it is negligible compared to their size. Of course, I'm new to all this Jeep stuff, what would I know.
 

Cummins_Powered

New member
Don't remember who told me or where I read it but I had the impression 1lb of rotational mass equaled 10lbs of static load. Which if you go from stock tires to say a 60-65lb tire you were "adding 400lbs plus of ""cargo"". Seemed like large affect but I never looking into it any further. Not that it really matters, I just like to know stuff. I shall do more research.

I have heard 10lbs too, but i think that is too much. Did a little more research and found someone else claiming 5lbs was a conservative estimate...In any case, it is definitely not 1:1 and i might have also been way too conservative with my 1:2. At 1:5 or 1:10, rotational mass starts to make quite a big difference in power at the wheels.
 

Jacalore

New member
Lift on, wheels installed, definitely feel the extra weight. Jeep feels heavier overall. I can see where regearing would be helpful. Gonna ride this way for awhile, re-evaluate. Brakes ok.

Seems to wander tho... have to constantly make small corrections. Steering seems tight, but wheels seem loose. Going for alignment, see how it feels after. Replace steering damper?
 
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