New Genright JKU cage vs EVO full cage?

[just-lift-it]

Well if most people are looking at such a product to protect them from a flip or maybe one complete roll why does everyone argue about being tied into the frame and triangulation this and that haha the factory cage isnt tied into the frame and passes safety tests and now you just going to add more strength to it correct? should be MORE then enough for a slow speed tumble...

maybe if you desert race like Evo 1 then yea for sure tie everything in multiple times I just cant wrap my head around peoples arguments for this at all, just doesnt make sense haha

 

[Tcdawg]

Well if most people are looking at such a product to protect them from a flip or maybe one complete roll why does everyone argue about being tied into the frame and triangulation this and that haha the factory cage isnt tied into the frame and passes safety tests and now you just going to add more strength to it correct? should be MORE then enough for a slow speed tumble...

maybe if you desert race like Evo 1 then yea for sure tie everything in multiple times I just cant wrap my head around peoples arguments for this at all, just doesnt make sense haha

Not sure one cage over another is an argument, more so an individual's preference.

Also, you don't get to pick how you crash...flops can turn into rolls and rolls can turn in to flips down a mountain...

 

[seanb123]

Well if most people are looking at such a product to protect them from a flip or maybe one complete roll why does everyone argue about being tied into the frame and triangulation this and that haha the factory cage isnt tied into the frame and passes safety tests and now you just going to add more strength to it correct? should be MORE then enough for a slow speed tumble...

maybe if you desert race like Evo 1 then yea for sure tie everything in multiple times I just cant wrap my head around peoples arguments for this at all, just doesnt make sense haha

People add cages because the factory cage isn't going stop everything. Sometimes it does well in crashes sometimes it looks like these pics

 

[Rusty]

People add cages because the factory cage isn't going stop everything. Sometimes it does well in crashes sometimes it looks like these pics View attachment 86262 View attachment 86263 View attachment 86264

My friends jeep after someone cut him off doing 60mph on a freeway stock cage... I've been patiently waiting the release of the genright cage since they first talked about it... and yet I'm still going to wait to see how it is actually built from pictures from other people.

 

[LoPo]

Do all the sport cages everyone loves and buys tie into the frame in multiple spots? or just bolt onto existing cage and body?

Only one kit that I know of that has an option to tie into the frame, that's Poly's. They all bolt/weld to the OEM cage and bolt to the tub in various places.

 

[LoPo]

Not sure one cage over another is an argument, more so an individual's preference.

Also, you don't get to pick how you crash...flops can turn into rolls and rolls can turn in to flips down a mountain...

Totally like everything about your comment. :thumb:

Just to add, the potential for your Jeep to end up on it's side or roof doesn't solely depend on being on a trail. It can happen on the way to the mall where I mostly wheel at.

 

[just-lift-it]

So most people agree that all the bolt to the body cages is enough for most accidents and the one like poly sells is more of an extreme situation most amount of safety roll cage?

 

[MTG]

So most people agree that all the bolt to the body cages is enough for most accidents and the one like poly sells is more of an extreme situation most amount of safety roll cage?

I think most people will never even need their factory cage...the factory cage is enough for most accidents....a sport cage is a bit better...a full replacement cage likely better still. I would also agree that everyone has a different comfort level and budget, and their e-opinions will be influenced by both.

 

[SmokinV10]

My friends jeep after someone cut him off doing 60mph on a freeway stock cage... I've been patiently waiting the release of the genright cage since they first talked about it... and yet I'm still going to wait to see how it is actually built from pictures from other people.
View attachment 86266 View attachment 86267

Any cage is going to be bad at 60mph. My OPINION from my road race days is that if you really want something to truly protect you for "worst case scenario" you'll need a cage with x braces, and so many tubes that you'll have a dedicated
Off road/trail rig. Modifying your car/hotrod/offroad rig can often be a slippery slope between streetability and ultimate dedicated hobby-centric functionality. In my experience, the roll cage, as nice as it is to have I catastrophic events was one of the primary contributing factors that turned my street rods into garage queens based on elimination of creature comforts. Think about it. Add a harness bar and you can't recline your front seats anymore. End of the world? No. Add a rear harness bar and you impact your ability to carry rear cargo. Wouldn't you want door braces or swing out door braces? More hassle to get in and out. Additional tubes impact ability to enter/exit. Then you're impacting the factory sound bar....maybe the shitty subwoofer. More squeaks and rattles to add to the suspension squeaks and wind noise and tire noise and exhaust drone. There is for most a straw that breaks the camels back....you just don't realize that you've reached that point until after you passed it. At what point are you dreading a drive to the mall or a quick errand? At what point do you find it parked for all purposes but your next trip to the trail? I've been there half a dozen times with street rods. Most of my gear head buddies have had rigs
That have done the same....and these aren't pansies that want "mall crawlers or garage queens". I personally just need a huge proof point that the more robust weld-in options are not overtly intrusive before taking the plunge this time. I added a sport cage to my build but stopped short of a weld in custom cage based on this premise. If someone can show me a truly "reasonably practical" option I would likely be willing to make a change/upgrade. I just can't envision such a system

 

[LoPo]

So most people agree that all the bolt to the body cages is enough for most accidents and the one like poly sells is more of an extreme situation most amount of safety roll cage?

You're getting into a pretty religious argument. But speaking in general terms, an OR-FAB(no longer for sale), Poly, Rock Hard, PSC would fit the need for the average JK owner who wheels. Note you can get the Poly cage and not install the frame tie-ins. You can also get it without the B Pillar or even the rear puts it close to others in terms of $.

Hopefully no one ever needs their OEM or aftermarket cages.

 

[MTG]

Any cage is going to be bad at 60mph. My OPINION from my road race days is that if you really want something to truly protect you for "worst case scenario" you'll need a cage with x braces, and so many tubes that you'll have a dedicated
Off road/trail rig. Modifying your car/hotrod/offroad rig can often be a slippery slope between streetability and ultimate dedicated hobby-centric functionality. In my experience, the roll cage, as nice as it is to have I catastrophic events was one of the primary contributing factors that turned my street rods into garage queens based on elimination of creature comforts. Think about it. Add a harness bar and you can't recline your front seats anymore. End of the world? No. Add a rear harness bar and you impact your ability to carry rear cargo. Wouldn't you want door braces or swing out door braces? More hassle to get in and out. Additional tubes impact ability to enter/exit. Then you're impacting the factory sound bar....maybe the shitty subwoofer. More squeaks and rattles to add to the suspension squeaks and wind noise and tire noise and exhaust drone. There is for most a straw that breaks the camels back....you just don't realize that you've reached that point until after you passed it. At what point are you dreading a drive to the mall or a quick errand? At what point do you find it parked for all purposes but your next trip to the trail? I've been there half a dozen times with street rods. Most of my gear head buddies have had rigs
That have done the same....and these aren't pansies that want "mall crawlers or garage queens". I personally just need a huge proof point that the more robust weld-in options are not overtly intrusive before taking the plunge this time. I added a sport cage to my build but stopped short of a weld in custom cage based on this premise. If someone can show me a truly "reasonably practical" option I would likely be willing to make a change/upgrade. I just can't envision such a system

I find your rationale perplexing. You are buying the top of the line suspension that is specifically designed for high speed off roading (well above 60 mph), axles that will withstand the abuse, and yet you're reluctant to get a full cage because of the sound bar and not reclining your seats. :thinking:

 

[SmokinV10]

I find your rationale perplexing. You are buying the top of the line suspension that is specifically designed for high speed off roading (well above 60 mph), axles that will withstand the abuse, and yet you're reluctant to get a full cage because of the sound bar and not reclining your seats. :thinking:

Because this isn't my first rodeo with a high performance rig. I have had several 1200+ whp rigs. 60+ mph offroad isn't a whole lot different than 140+ mph on a road course or leaving the line at the drag strip with the front tires in the air from a safety standpoint. If you were to ask me if I would put a roll cage in those cars again, I would say no it got to a point where the roll cage became the proverbial bane of the rigs existence. In all the rigs, sound systems fell at the sword for some performance reason, with the cage being part of that reason. I dreaded getting in and out. Hated trying to put items in areas of the cars. Granted there were other contributing factors such as obnixous exhuast fumes, and erratic idle, but I found myself finding excuses not to drive those rigs. I had all sorts of "practical" reasons to justify the cage...everything from NHRA/IHRA/SCCA regulations to plain old safety but found myself not using the car at the end of the day. My other half hated getting in them and I missed the creature comforts for everyday use. I want to continue use my Jeep and don't want it's trail worthiness to come at too much of the expense of its practicality. Why do you think I cared about garage height when making the choice to go to 40's? When I'm ready to ditch my creature comforts. I'll build a dedicated trial rig. **I may be wrong** but I don't think Moby has a full weld in cage either.

 

[travisk]

I don't think Moby has a full wled in cage either.

I think he likes that Rock Hard cage.

 

[SmokinV10]

I think he likes that Rock Hard cage.

And thats what I have purchased/ordered as well. I just cant find a compelling reason to go with something else when I mix all the intentiions on how I want to use the rig, both on road and off-road.

 

[GCM 2]

.....60+ mph offroad isn't a whole lot different than 140+ mph on a road course or leaving the line at the drag strip with the front tires in the air from a safety standpoint.

This is not a statement of someone who understands what he is getting into and shows you have entered into a new form of motosport, with level of a build that puts you at risk of getting yourself into a lot of trouble. This really seems to be just a flash in the pan that caught your eye for whatever reason. Your comparison of the a high horsepower road car and an extremely capable trail rig are not even in the same ball park. Did you know that the majority of offroad roll overs happen when the vehicle is practically stationary, with zero speed involved? :doh:

 

[SmokinV10]

This is not a statement of someone who understands what he is getting into and shows you have entered into a new form of motosport, with level of a build that puts you at risk of getting yourself into a lot of trouble. This really seems to be just a flash in the pan that caught your for whatever reason. Your comparison of the a high horsepower road car and an extremely capable trail rig are not even in the same ball park. Did you know that the majority of offroad roll overs happen when the vehicle is practically stationary, with zero speed involved? :doh:

I know this isnt about you or others and y'all are just giving advice..... but do you have a full weld in cage? I opted for a sport cage, but stopped short of a full blown cage for a variety of reasons (already talked about).

I understand completely what I am "getting into", but am heavily weighing the pro's cons of my build and intentions with my own life experiences and my own behaviors after making those choices.

 

[MTG]

Because this isn't my first rodeo with a high performance rig. I have had several 1200+ whp rigs. 60+ mph offroad isn't a whole lot different than 140+ mph on a road course or leaving the line at the drag strip with the front tires in the air from a safety standpoint. If you were to ask me if I would put a roll cage in those cars again, I would say no it got to a point where the roll cage became the proverbial bane of the rigs existence. I dreaded getting in and out. Hated trying to put items in areas of the cars. I found myself finding excuses not to drive those rigs. I had all sorts of "practical" reasons to justify the cage...everything from NHRA/IHRA/SCCA regulations to plain old safety but found myself not using the car at the end of the day. My other half hated getting in them and I missed the creature comforts for everyday use. I want to continue use my Jeep and don't want it's trail worthiness to come at too much of the expense of its practicality. Why do you think I cared about garage height when making the choice to go to 40's? When I'm ready to ditch my creature comforts I'll build a dedicated trial rig. **I may be wrong** but I don't think Moby has a full wled in cage either.

I get it...you race(d) your rigs. But I'm guessing a 1200 whp car isn't something you generally take to get eggs and milk regardless of whether it has a cage or not. I understand the tension and I've gone back and forth a lot on my own jeep...still do, in fact. Particularly with respect to normal my passengers. If you're building your jeep the way you are building it (I assume you are building it to use it the way it is meant to be used and are not simply overbuilding it), I just don't see the factors you mentioned as hindering it's streetability. **I may be wrong** but I also thought you were talking about getting a V8, which tells me you like to go fast. I think you (or anyone with a V8 and the underside built to keep up), is simply asking for trouble by relying on the factory cage. Hell, I think you can go pretty fast with the 3.6 or even the 3.8. Will an accident happen? Not likely, but like much in life you are simply playing the odds. As I mentioned above, everyone has a different comfort level, will prioritize differently and will spend their budget accordingly. But that just my :twocents: And besides I always adhere to my motto of safety third. :cheesy:

 

[SmokinV10]

I get it...you race(d) your rigs. But I'm guessing a 1200 whp car isn't something you generally take to get eggs and milk regardless of whether it has a cage or not. I understand the tension and I've gone back and forth a lot on my own jeep...still do, in fact. Particularly with respect to normal my passengers. If you're building your jeep the way you are building it (I assume you are building it to use it the way it is meant to be used and are not simply overbuilding it), I just don't see the factors you mentioned as hindering it's streetability. **I may be wrong** but I also thought you were talking about getting a V8, which tells me you like to go fast. I think you (or anyone with a V8 and the underside built to keep up), is simply asking for trouble by relying on the factory cage. Hell, I think you can go pretty fast with the 3.6 or even the 3.8. Will an accident happen? Not likely, but like much in life you are simply playing the odds. As I mentioned above, everyone has a different comfort level, will prioritize differently and will spend their budget accordingly. But that just my :twocents: And besides I always adhere to my motto of safety third. :cheesy:

You have a point. Dont think that you f'ers arent making me itch to pick up the phone, call drew and add another $6K to the build. But I know its going to be more than that after I customize the crap out of it and make it work the way I want it to work. What will really suck is if thats the "straw" that makes me leave the rig at home and I'm stacking 2x4's to the roof of my Jaguar at Home Depot because there are bars everywhere in my jeep or the fiancee doesnt want to go anywhere in at anymore...or I end up coming home with a new F250 because "I cant/dont want to use my jeep for other things" anymore. That will go over like a fart in church.

 

[LoPo]

And thats what I have purchased/ordered as well. I just cant find a compelling reason to go with something else when I mix all the intentiions on how I want to use the rig, both on road and off-road.

Then you should be all set, right? I don't think anyone so far in this thread has tried to convince you otherwise. Or maybe I missed a page.

 

[SmokinV10]

Then you should be all set, right? I don't think anyone so far in this thread has tried to convince you otherwise. Or maybe I missed a page.

Seems that there is a contingent that thinks I should be more seriously considering a more robust weld in/custom option...