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View Full Version : What is the main difference between the Front Dana 44 on the Rubicon and the Rear 44?



jorgelrod
03-08-2015, 12:04 PM
This is more of an educational question for me as the more I spend on the forum and see the axle questions, the more I learn. I see that the main response to axles is going to the ProRock 44 in the front and when speaking of the Rear, They say the stock is plenty strong unless going above 40's etc. What differences are there between the Front and rear 44 (I also read once something someone said about the rear being a true 44) where going PR 44 rear or PR60 are options to be considered...

Again, I know there are hundreds of axle threads on "What should I buy??" but this is more of a thread to help me understand differences towards the future based on my Overlanding and 10% Rock 90% mud type wheeling locally goals...

cozdude
03-08-2015, 12:16 PM
The front Dana 44 is only a name. The reason is because its shares the exact same C's and axle tubes as the Dana 30. The only reason it can be called a 44 is because the housing is a 44 and you can run a 44 ring gear.

The rear 44 has bigger tubes which allows it to be stronger and a true d44. You can run a 37" tire on it without having to worry about failing for a long time.

jorgelrod
03-08-2015, 12:22 PM
Thanks, that is the type of answer I was looking for...

cozdude
03-08-2015, 12:26 PM
Thanks, that is the type of answer I was looking for...

Your welcome. That is the reason why people will ditch the front 44, because it's no stronger than the 30. If your max tire size is going to be 37's then the pr44 would be perfect. Then if and when your rear 44 fails you can get a Dynatrac trail60 to keep the cost down but also it will be way stronger than your factory 44.

jedg
03-08-2015, 12:50 PM
Your welcome. That is the reason why people will ditch the front 44, because it's no stronger than the 30. If your max tire size is going to be 37's then the pr44 would be perfect. Then if and when your rear 44 fails you can get a Dynatrac trail60 to keep the cost down but also it will be way stronger than your factory 44.

I -kind- of new this... but really hadn't seen it stated succinctly. So I'll ask a follow on question. I'm running a 6.0L. I'm running a 35" tire now and MIGHT go to a 37" tire at some point. This is a daily driver that I do off road and rock crawl maybe 6 times a year. Would the above advice still be sound? **EDIT** Another thought, would a PR44 front and a rear OEM 44 with upgraded axle shafts be what I'm looking for?

jorgelrod
03-08-2015, 01:09 PM
I guess the PR44 and the rear 44 will last me a long time, as I stated, most of the stuff here is mud and water and I don't see myself going beyond 35s. My rig is sort of becoming an Overland kind of vehicle for camping, that does not mean I won't "just wheel it" but as the weight starts to pile on, Fridge, rack, awning, tent etc on Overland trips, going with too tall tires is counterproductive...

It's nice that you bring the Trail 60 into the conversation as the main concern shifts from breaking it due to heavy foot to breaking it due to weight on the vehicle, although again, I'm pretty sure the rear 44 should be plenty strong...

Canvas JK
03-08-2015, 01:36 PM
Your rear D44 will last a long time. Where you run into problems is bombing through rough roads and getting air born. If you look at the 2013 JKX there is a JK that was traveling at a high rate of speed and actually got air born and broke is rear axle.

Rubicam just recently upgraded to Moby's old PR60 rear axle. I believe they put almost 60K miles on the rear D44 before the swap.

Again it will all depend on how hard and fast you go off road.

R/
Will

cozdude
03-08-2015, 02:28 PM
I -kind- of new this... but really hadn't seen it stated succinctly. So I'll ask a follow on question. I'm running a 6.0L. I'm running a 35" tire now and MIGHT go to a 37" tire at some point. This is a daily driver that I do off road and rock crawl maybe 6 times a year. Would the above advice still be sound? **EDIT** Another thought, would a PR44 front and a rear OEM 44 with upgraded axle shafts be what I'm looking for?

Since your running a 6.0L your main problem would be the amount of torque over the amount of weight from tires and your rig weight. Because of that I would just look into a pr60. The bigger shafts and bigger ring and pinion would be able to handle that torque better.


I guess the PR44 and the rear 44 will last me a long time, as I stated, most of the stuff here is mud and water and I don't see myself going beyond 35s. My rig is sort of becoming an Overland kind of vehicle for camping, that does not mean I won't "just wheel it" but as the weight starts to pile on, Fridge, rack, awning, tent etc on Overland trips, going with too tall tires is counterproductive...

It's nice that you bring the Trail 60 into the conversation as the main concern shifts from breaking it due to heavy foot to breaking it due to weight on the vehicle, although again, I'm pretty sure the rear 44 should be plenty strong...

Yea a pr44 and the stock rear will suite you perfectly then for what you wanna do. As mentioned you will only need to upgrade to a trail 60 or replace it with a stock 44 again if it break or you ran out of upgrades to do lol

2013rubirick
03-08-2015, 04:24 PM
You better check your rosetta welds also on your rear axle because this can happen pretty easy129294.

cozdude
03-08-2015, 07:08 PM
You better check your rosetta welds also on your rear axle because this can happen pretty easy129294.

Yup this is the only thing to worry about with the d44 in the 12+ models. The Rosetta welds look like boogers

jorgelrod
03-08-2015, 10:32 PM
Yup this is the only thing to worry about with the d44 in the 12+ models. The Rosetta welds look like boogers

Oh WOW!, that sucks...

tobias lopez
03-10-2015, 02:36 PM
The front Dana 44 is only a name. The reason is because its shares the exact same C's and axle tubes as the Dana 30. The only reason it can be called a 44 is because the housing is a 44 and you can run a 44 ring gear.

The rear 44 has bigger tubes which allows it to be stronger and a true d44. You can run a 37" tire on it without having to worry about failing for a long time.

So I having a discussion here at work about a true Dana 44 (rear) and a front Dana 44 which is the same as a Dana 30 other than the housing. Like u had said. But he is the FACT type of person is there somewhere I can get the FACTS at?

tobias lopez
03-10-2015, 02:53 PM
Nvm found me an old thread. :)

wayoflife
03-10-2015, 02:56 PM
I -kind- of new this... but really hadn't seen it stated succinctly. So I'll ask a follow on question. I'm running a 6.0L. I'm running a 35" tire now and MIGHT go to a 37" tire at some point. This is a daily driver that I do off road and rock crawl maybe 6 times a year. Would the above advice still be sound? **EDIT** Another thought, would a PR44 front and a rear OEM 44 with upgraded axle shafts be what I'm looking for?

As mentioned, what you should be concerned with is the amount of torque your motor puts out. I run a 6.2L in my JKU and swapped out my perfectly good ProRock 60 for a ProRock 80 in the rear and still run a ProRock 60 up front. Of course, I have been able to break other axles with just my old POS 3.8L motor. If the trails you run aren't breaking things for you now, maybe you'll be okay but I wouldn't have any faith in a 44 rear with that much power.

wayoflife
03-10-2015, 02:58 PM
Nvm found me an old thread. :)

LOL! Just go out and measure the diameter of a Dana 30 axle tube and then measure a factory front Dana 44. Physically look at the end forgings - they are EXACTLY the same. That should be FACT enough :yup:

tobias lopez
03-10-2015, 03:31 PM
LOL! Just go out and measure the diameter of a Dana 30 axle tube and then measure a factory front Dana 44. Physically look at the end forgings - they are EXACTLY the same. That should be FACT enough :yup:

Lol I had foward him a link to an old thread but he doesn't listen lol.

http://wayalife.com/showthread.php?15133-Dana-30-vs-Dana-44

I think we're going to have a lunch measure his front 44 and my 30 lol.

this started because he thinks his front 44 is the same as his rear. So I made the statement that his front isn't a true 44 like his rear and that his 44 and my 30 are the same other than the housing.

Reaper
03-10-2015, 03:34 PM
So if you gusset the c's on the rubicon dana 44 its a badass axle again?

tobias lopez
03-10-2015, 03:34 PM
Is there a diffrence between the shafts and stub shafts other than length? Is it stronger than the Dana 30?

wayoflife
03-10-2015, 03:35 PM
Lol I had foward him a link to an old thread but he doesn't listen lol.

http://wayalife.com/showthread.php?15133-Dana-30-vs-Dana-44

I think we're going to have a lunch measure his front 44 and my 30 lol.

this started because he thinks his front 44 is the same as his rear. So I made the statement that his front isn't a true 44 like his rear and that his 44 and my 30 are the same other than the housing.

Actually, to be clear, your "tubes" and "end forgings" or C's are the same but the diff, ring and pinion and shafts are different. Essentially, both your front "housings" are pretty much the same thing - it's just the internals that are different.

tobias lopez
03-10-2015, 03:37 PM
Actually, to be clear, your "tubes" and "end forgings" or C's are the same but the diff, ring and pinion and shafts are different. Essentially, both your front "housings" are pretty much the same thing - it's just the internals that are different.

Got it thank you! !:)

wayoflife
03-10-2015, 03:37 PM
So if you gusset the c's on the rubicon dana 44 its a badass axle again?

:cheesy:


Is there a diffrence between the shafts and stub shafts other than length? Is it stronger than the Dana 30?

Yes, the shafts in a factory front Dana 44 will have beefier shafts with 30 splines whereas a Dana 30 will have only 27 splines. The stubs are the same.

Reaper
03-10-2015, 03:43 PM
:cheesy:



Yes, the shafts in a factory front Dana 44 will have beefier shafts with 30 splines whereas a Dana 30 will have only 27 splines. The stubs are the same.


haha ok so is that a no?

Reaper
03-10-2015, 03:43 PM
first time of me hearing about this

tobias lopez
03-10-2015, 03:43 PM
:cheesy:

Lol

Yes, the shafts in a factory front Dana 44 will have beefier shafts with 30 splines whereas a Dana 30 will have only 27 splines. The stubs are the same.

Ok. Perfect now I can be specific when I tell him the diffrence other than just saying bro my 30 is like ur 44 let's just trade lmao!!

tobias lopez
03-10-2015, 03:53 PM
first time of me hearing about this

Aww man I thought you were being sarcastic lol.

From my understanding it all really depends on the type off offroading you do. Add C's reenforce a weak point on the axle but can still bend.

So to answer your question yes for a short period of time because u will have the mindset that you can now go harder with you newly installed C's so that's when they can bend lol.

Reaper
03-10-2015, 04:12 PM
ah ok thanks for the info

tobias lopez
03-10-2015, 04:22 PM
ah ok thanks for the info

It more than just the type of wheeling other factors contribute to making the already weak point more susceptible to bending.

wayoflife
03-10-2015, 04:40 PM
haha ok so is that a no?

:cheesy: Sorry, I thought you were kidding.

Being that you're in FL, you'll probably be fine with just adding c gussets. Bending of the axle tubes typically happens with hard and fast driving like what you can do out in the west.

Reaper
03-10-2015, 06:51 PM
ah ok the true overland stuff huh

Bingobelle
03-10-2015, 07:17 PM
Thing is, what are hard wheeling? What Eddie calls hard wheeling is probably insanity for me and what I think is hard wheeling that have a stock saharah 2012 is for sure a sunday walk in the park for Eddie and his friends.

What is easy for me to do is impossible for my friends that have normal sedans with 2 wheel drive.

Anyway, I guess that normal driving and some "overlanding travel" on bad roads from one country to a another a stock axel with stock tires like 32 to 33" will work. Correct me if Im wrong.

But one thing is for sure, you Americans and Aussies can all be very happy because you have some great landscapes to explore and a lot of nice trails you can drive. Here in Sweden we do have nice scenery but no trails at all and the kind of nature we have make it impossible to go wheeling like you guys can do. Thick forest, very big stones and large hills of stone everywhere and on top of that it is forbidden to take the car ouside the road ( doent matter since mother nature makes it impossible anyway).

So, it is with envy I sitt here in front of my f***ing computer screen, watching your lovely adventure.

Happy Wheeling all!

CrazyLarry
03-10-2015, 08:20 PM
Thing is, what are hard wheeling? What Eddie calls hard wheeling is probably insanity for me and what I think is hard wheeling that have a stock saharah 2012 is for sure a sunday walk in the park for Eddie and his friends.

What is easy for me to do is impossible for my friends that have normal sedans with 2 wheel drive.

Anyway, I guess that normal driving and some "overlanding travel" on bad roads from one country to a another a stock axel with stock tires like 32 to 33" will work. Correct me if Im wrong.

But one thing is for sure, you Americans and Aussies can all be very happy because you have some great landscapes to explore and a lot of nice trails you can drive. Here in Sweden we do have nice scenery but no trails at all and the kind of nature we have make it impossible to go wheeling like you guys can do. Thick forest, very big stones and large hills of stone everywhere and on top of that it is forbidden to take the car ouside the road ( doent matter since mother nature makes it impossible anyway).

So, it is with envy I sitt here in front of my f***ing computer screen, watching your lovely adventure.

Happy Wheeling all!

You guys have a shitload of hot women though :brows: Hell with the Jeep lol

Reaper
03-10-2015, 08:27 PM
You guys have a shitload of hot women though :brows: Hell with the Jeep lol

agreed!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

jorgelrod
03-22-2015, 10:24 PM
You better check your rosetta welds also on your rear axle because this can happen pretty easy129294.

So, this is what mine look like, should I be worried??
132541
132542

olram30
03-22-2015, 10:30 PM
So, this is what mine look like, should I be worried??
132541
132542

That top one looks pretty bad. Dana went down hill in the past few years on their quality.

bouche03
03-23-2015, 01:53 AM
You better check your rosetta welds also on your rear axle because this can happen pretty easy129294.

Could someone explain what exactly would cause this to happen?!

wayoflife
03-23-2015, 01:58 AM
Could someone explain what exactly would cause this to happen?!

A lot of throttle - sudden stop if the rear tires - rosette welds breaking - diff housing rotates up.