Is All This Becoming TOO Popular?

[wayoflife]

On a recent trek that took Cindy and I through Death Valley, we ran into a friend of ours who's in law enforcement and so I took some time to ask him about the park. Knowing that there was extensive damage to a lot of the roads and trails from the big storm that rolled through the area in August of 2023, I was kind of hoping to get an idea of what was open, what was not and regarding the later, when things would open up again. And, if there was one thing that he mentioned that really caught my attention, it was in regards to things that had been closed or restricted due to overuse.

Obviously, things out in our National Parks and trails as a whole have changed a LOT over the years and much of this is due to the ever growing popularity off roading. Talking to our friend, he said that this really started to explode during the virus years as people turned to camping or "overlanding" to escape from the dungeons that they were forced to live in. Certainly, this is something that Cindy and I saw first hand, all across remote stretches of Nevada and in places where we never saw anyone ever before. Unfortunately, this surge in off road/overlanding popularity has significantly impacted areas in places like Death Valley and with all kinds of trash, shit (as in literally, the stuff that comes out of your ass) and damage to sensitive areas. Unfortunately, lacking the kind of resources necessary to deal with the onslaught of people heading out to these wild places, a lot of them have just been closed off.

After reading a thread that @DirtHeadDavis posted up about Anza Borrego, describing something similar and listening to how it made him feel, I started to wonder... is all this becoming TOO popular? I would never pretend to have an answer for any of this but I am interested in hearing what you think about it.

 

[WJCO]

Sucks for sure. Sad.

 

[JT@623]

Unfortunately it has become popular with s class of people who care only about themselves. Look around the generation that want to save the planet are responsible for it’s destruction

 

[OverlanderJK]

I wonder if cost has something to do with it. It’s relatively cheap to go to the desert and camp and tear shit up. It’ll cost you $10k to go to Disney for a weekend for a family.

 

[Spazbyt]

This reminds me of a saying my father had. "If you give people something free they will break it and if they can't break it they'll shit on it" As sad as it is, I'm afraid this trend will continue. Jeeps, broncos, and Toyotas are all more popular than ever. "Overlanding" and Van life has become crazy popular, side by sides are literally everywhere. BLM seems to be looking for a reason to restrict access, especially by vehicles, and over use will be the only excuse they need to shut it all down.

 

[matt]

On a recent trek that took Cindy and I through Death Valley, we ran into a friend of ours who's in law enforcement and so I took some time to ask him about the park. Knowing that there was extensive damage to a lot of the roads and trails from the big storm that rolled through the area in August of 2023, I was kind of hoping to get an idea of what was open, what was not and regarding the later, when things would open up again. And, if there was one thing that he mentioned that really caught my attention, it was in regards to things that had been closed or restricted due to overuse.

Obviously, things out in our National Parks and trails as a whole have changed a LOT over the years and much of this is due to the ever growing popularity off roading. Talking to our friend, he said that this really started to explode during the virus years as people turned to camping or "overlanding" to escape from the dungeons that they were forced to live in. Certainly, this is something that Cindy and I saw first hand, all across remote stretches of Nevada and in places where we never saw anyone ever before. Unfortunately, this surge in off road/overlanding popularity has significantly impacted areas in places like Death Valley and with all kinds of trash, shit (as in literally, the stuff that comes out of your ass) and damage to sensitive areas. Unfortunately, lacking the kind of resources necessary to deal with the onslaught of people heading out to these wild places, a lot of them have just been closed off.

After reading a thread that @DirtHeadDavis posted up about Anza Borrego, describing something similar and listening to how it made him feel, I started to wonder... is all this becoming TOO popular? I would never pretend to have an answer for any of this but I am interested in hearing what you think about it.

I have noticed this for a while now. Back in CA they closed trails to cars so you had to hike to get own to the camp where before you could drive to that spot and walk down to the river to fish it. that was in the late 90's. I think the internet is helping more people get into things they wouldnt have otherwise. I've camped, hiked, rode dualsport, or wheeled thoughout my life and have seen all kinds of crap (pardon the pun).

I remember one Project-JK easy run where we went out to that crashed F4 in the desert, maybe that was the new years run sorry dont remember. I dont know if you remember that but someone had bagged up most of the titanium and aluminum and was going to haul it out.

Theres a changing mindset in this country now.

Edit: Found a pic, if you look close enough you see a black trashbag, there were several out there. I wonder if any of that stuff is still left?

 

[DirtHeadDavis]

It's all too common I think in anything labeled as a "state park." Large sums of people gather at these places looking for the essence of exploration or something when in reality these areas are well known, very well documented already, and mapped out (with directions) on their iPads the "overlanders" have mounted to their dash these days.

 

[OverlanderJK]

I have noticed this for a while now. Back in CA they closed trails to cars so you had to hike to get own to the camp where before you could drive to that spot and walk down to the river to fish it. that was in the late 90's. I think the internet is helping more people get into things they wouldnt have otherwise. I've camped, hiked, rode dualsport, or wheeled thoughout my life and have seen all kinds of crap (pardon the pun).

I remember one Project-JK easy run where we went out to that crashed F4 in the desert, maybe that was the new years run sorry dont remember. I dont know if you remember that but someone had bagged up most of the titanium and aluminum and was going to haul it out.

Theres a changing mindset in this country now.

New years 2013 I think.

 

[wayoflife]

I wonder if cost has something to do with it. It’s relatively cheap to go to the desert and camp and tear shit up. It’ll cost you $10k to go to Disney for a weekend for a family.

It wouldn't surprise me in the least if cost was a significant factor and your Disney example is on point.

 

[wayoflife]

This reminds me of a saying my father had. "If you give people something free they will break it and if they can't break it they'll shit on it" As sad as it is, I'm afraid this trend will continue. Jeeps, broncos, and Toyotas are all more popular than ever. "Overlanding" and Van life has become crazy popular, side by sides are literally everywhere. BLM seems to be looking for a reason to restrict access, especially by vehicles, and over use will be the only excuse they need to shut it all down.

Out in places like Moab, the BLM definitely seems to be looking for a reason to close or restrict areas but out in the Mojave, I think they're just understaffed and overwhelmed. Obviously, I am not for closing or restricting anything but I have personally seen how bad things have gotten over the years and it's only getting worse.

 

[wayoflife]

I have noticed this for a while now. Back in CA they closed trails to cars so you had to hike to get own to the camp where before you could drive to that spot and walk down to the river to fish it. that was in the late 90's. I think the internet is helping more people get into things they wouldnt have otherwise. I've camped, hiked, rode dualsport, or wheeled thoughout my life and have seen all kinds of crap (pardon the pun).

I remember one Project-JK easy run where we went out to that crashed F4 in the desert, maybe that was the new years run sorry dont remember. I dont know if you remember that but someone had bagged up most of the titanium and aluminum and was going to haul it out.

Theres a changing mindset in this country now.

New years 2013 I think.

What Adam said, 2013 New Year Kick Off Run and yes, I am aware that there's nothing left of the crash site. It is because of it that I am super reluctant to share any of the places that I really love with anyone other than close friends and absolutely HATE the internet for all the whores that do share places like this and just for a few "likes".

 

[wayoflife]

It's all too common I think in anything labeled as a "state park." Large sums of people gather at these places looking for the essence of exploration or something when in reality these areas are well known, very well documented already, and mapped out (with directions) on their iPads the "overlanders" have mounted to their dash these days.

As you know, I fully blame the internet and more so, social whoring for a lot of what we're seeing today. It's not that these places were ever hard to find, it just took research, reading of books or having locals show you around. It was the effort that made it fun for people like me and made it hard for shitheads to destroy everything. Today, it's just too easy. But, that's just my opinion.

 

[Brute]

There are more people than twenty years ago. There are more off road vehicles than twenty years ago. There is not more land than twenty years ago.

 

[matt]

What Adam said, 2013 New Year Kick Off Run and yes, I am aware that there's nothing left of the crash site. It is because of it that I am super reluctant to share any of the places that I really love with anyone other than close friends and absolutely HATE the internet for all the whores that do share places like this and just for a few "likes".

I found a picture and added it to the original post, 1/22/2011 so must have been the new years run. Yes, I am thrilled you dont post up publicly and keep these places on the downlow. Gotta try and preserve these locations as long as you (we as a comunity)can.

I'd love to get back to CA and do some exploring again some day. Now that I have the Gladiator the juices are flowing to get back out, iId like to wheel in CA again, I really miss Big Bear, the desert and NorCal wheeling, there are some beautiful places out there.

 

[wayoflife]

I found a picture and added it to the original post, 1/22/2011 so must have been the new years run. Yes, I am thrilled you dont post up publicly and keep these places on the downlow. Gotta try and preserve these locations as long as you (we as a comunity)can.

I'd love to get back to CA and do some exploring again some day. Now that I have the Gladiator the juices are flowing to get back out, iId like to wheel in CA again, I really miss Big Bear, the desert and NorCal wheeling, there are some beautiful places out there.

You're right, I looked it up and that was from our new year kick off run for 2011. We made a video about it years later and you can see it here:

There's nothing more that I would love to do than to share places like this with others and we used to all the time. Now a days, it's all I can do to try and keep information on how to find these places a secret.

 

[AZVAJKU]

I think it reflects the general breakdown of society. So many individuals just don’t care about anything outside of themselves nor do they care about anything other than the here and the now. It’s largely the same group who do not return shopping carts, don’t hold doors for others, and are just generally shitty self-centered obnoxious ass-holes.

 

[jeeeep]

On a recent trek that took Cindy and I through Death Valley, we ran into a friend of ours who's in law enforcement and so I took some time to ask him about the park. Knowing that there was extensive damage to a lot of the roads and trails from the big storm that rolled through the area in August of 2023, I was kind of hoping to get an idea of what was open, what was not and regarding the later, when things would open up again. And, if there was one thing that he mentioned that really caught my attention, it was in regards to things that had been closed or restricted due to overuse.

Obviously, things out in our National Parks and trails as a whole have changed a LOT over the years and much of this is due to the ever growing popularity off roading. Talking to our friend, he said that this really started to explode during the virus years as people turned to camping or "overlanding" to escape from the dungeons that they were forced to live in. Certainly, this is something that Cindy and I saw first hand, all across remote stretches of Nevada and in places where we never saw anyone ever before. Unfortunately, this surge in off road/overlanding popularity has significantly impacted areas in places like Death Valley and with all kinds of trash, shit (as in literally, the stuff that comes out of your ass) and damage to sensitive areas. Unfortunately, lacking the kind of resources necessary to deal with the onslaught of people heading out to these wild places, a lot of them have just been closed off.

After reading a thread that @DirtHeadDavis posted up about Anza Borrego, describing something similar and listening to how it made him feel, I started to wonder... is all this becoming TOO popular? I would never pretend to have an answer for any of this but I am interested in hearing what you think about it.

while there had been an increased interest in the RV life over the years, covid brought out the "van life", "overlanding" youtube "look at me" morons and put it on steroids.

I was talking to a family member who's been a park ranger for 20+ years and has worked several national parks across the USA, his comments mirror what your friend told you, covid brought out the worst of the self-entitled younger crowds, they would constantly have to chase them out of the park for overstaying the limited timeframes and because many of them were on youtube and posting locations for some of the harder to find spots (as a means to get around the time limits) it made them have to close areas for "overuse" but, it was really to clean up the waste and trash these people left behind as they would crowd into slots made for a single camp; because of the lack of manpower, they would leave the areas closed.

Pisses me off when I get into an area that is not meant for camping, but some jackass has setup a broken-down RV, tents, their clothing and shit hanging off the trees and lines strung around their area with more hanging shit as if they're homesteading and then the stench of human waste --- fucking hippies.

After knee surgery I was looking forward to doing some camping but every campground I've wanted to get into in the mountain areas have been at capacity and reservations are encouraged a year in advance!

I miss the days of being able to book a campsite a few months in advance, I have no idea if I'll be able to commit a year out.

I read an article not too long ago that the van life/overlanding trend is starting to lose it's shine and am really hoping that it is.

I also wonder how many of the same people book multiple weeks throughout the summers year after year.

I guess I could of stated all of that with

 

[Brute]

There is a river, my favorite in WA that I go to every year to fly fish. You can't drive there. There are limited places to stay. You can't rent a car (I used to fish it by bike). There is no cell service and very limited wifi access. These are some of the things (not counting 20" cutthroats) that I enjoy about going there...but every year I get on the boat ferry to go uplake to this place, I see more and more people bringing rods on the boat. Some of the land owners have built extra cabins for people to stay at; some with cars. Usually I don't see a single person fishing the river when I'm on it, now occasionally I see a few. This all has happened within the 7 years I have been fishing it...

It is the way of the world...

 

[Moochie]

You're right, I looked it up and that was from our new year kick off run for 2011. We made a video about it years later and you can see it here:

There's nothing more that I would love to do than to share places like this with others and we used to all the time. Now a days, it's all I can do to try and keep information on how to find these places a secret.

What a great group of people on this run!

 

[matt]

You're right, I looked it up and that was from our new year kick off run for 2011. We made a video about it years later and you can see it here:

There's nothing more that I would love to do than to share places like this with others and we used to all the time. Now a days, it's all I can do to try and keep information on how to find these places a secret.

Wow how great it was to see after all these years, even got a shot of me in there. hahahaha Another great job from you guys, and Andrew in there too.

I gotta give you props for organizing these runs Eddie, I know how stressful it must be making sure evreyone gets off the trails safely. This brought back some great memories for me for sure. Thanks for posting this up I never new this video existed.