TeraFlex Long Arm Bracket Break

wayoflife

Administrator
Staff member
Picked the Jeep up from the shop today. Bracket repaired. They noted that the control arm was actually 1/2 inch shorter than the passenger side... which contributed to the failure. :gaah:

That could very well be true. I don't know if they still do but for a long time, TeraFlex was erroneously telling people to shorten up one side in a misguided effort to add cross caster. I don't know where they got the crazy idea that you could do that with a solid axle but, they were wrong and I have seen more than one control arm break or, in your case, a mount because of it.
 
Picked the Jeep up from the shop today. Bracket repaired. They noted that the control arm was actually 1/2 inch shorter than the passenger side... which contributed to the failure. :gaah:

View attachment 16616

Also saw a familiar ass. ;) :thumb:

View attachment 16617

Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using WAYALIFE mobile app

Thanks for the help out a KOh
Sorry to here you broke you should have let us know we had the crews at the pits with the welders !
 

jkmadness

New member
That could very well be true. I don't know if they still do but for a long time, TeraFlex was erroneously telling people to shorten up one side in a misguided effort to add cross caster. I don't know where they got the crazy idea that you could do that with a solid axle but, they were wrong and I have seen more than one control arm break or, in your case, a mount because of it.

Yeap they still do, I though it was stupid myself
 

wayoflife

Administrator
Staff member
Nope , on the instructions of the FRONT LCA's from teraflex states clearly 23'1/8 driver side,23" 1/4 passenger side for a 3" lift...No Kidding,This is definitely non sense View attachment 16817

You would think that someone would have figured it out by now that you can't force a solid axle to have cross caster and that maybe, just maybe, some of the breaks they have been seeing has been caused by this really bad information. :naw:
 

rinkishjk

New member
The tf instructions do say that. In fact when I first installed my flex arms I did set the arms to exactly what they say.. It didn't handle good at all. I have since used my angle finder, tape measure, and my knowledge and fine tuned them and it's great now.
 

LoPo

Caught the Bug
Just thought I'd I post up the instructions for my lift specifically, looks like they don't(at least now) state specific lengths to set, rather they talk about degree differences. I'm not sure if there is a direct correlation to 1/4 to 1/2" or not.

tflainstall.jpg

I did watch the install videos that TF provides for the Long Arm kit and they explicitly show welding the bracket how cuongdyna's is welded. I think I may have to have my local shop add some welds when it gets back up on the rack in a few weeks.

http://wayalife.com/showthread.php?4743-TeraFlex-Long-Arm-Bracket-Break&p=58441&viewfull=1#post58441
 

wayoflife

Administrator
Staff member
The tf instructions do say that. In fact when I first installed my flex arms I did set the arms to exactly what they say.. It didn't handle good at all. I have since used my angle finder, tape measure, and my knowledge and fine tuned them and it's great now.

Glad that you were able to toss what they told you to do and get your Jeep driving well again. :thumb:

Just thought I'd I post up the instructions for my lift specifically, looks like they don't(at least now) state specific lengths to set, rather they talk about degree differences. I'm not sure if there is a direct correlation to 1/4 to 1/2" or not.

View attachment 17329

I did watch the install videos that TF provides for the Long Arm kit and they explicitly show welding the bracket how cuongdyna's is welded. I think I may have to have my local shop add some welds when it gets back up on the rack in a few weeks.

http://wayalife.com/showthread.php?4743-TeraFlex-Long-Arm-Bracket-Break&p=58441&viewfull=1#post58441

They are still trying to do the same thing. Essentially, attempt to have a different degree on one side from the other on a soild axle. It's almost frightening that they would really believe this is a good idea.
 

LoPo

Caught the Bug
Well, in all fairness, LoPo is running EVO coil overs and the amount of flex they provide is something I have seen to be more than the TeraFlex long arm kit can handle. Of course, they were never designed to either.

I have seen your control arm from the hammers in post here. But you understand that with extreme builds with that amount of flex need components built for that. Teraflex lifts weren't built specify for coilovers.


I really hate to rebirth this thread, but since I was used as the primary example in this thread I wanted to address the above statements. The quote from SilverBackJK is from the Teraflex are apart of TransAmerica Megacorp thread but is an example of the misconception of "too much flex" for a particular system.

Many, MANY rigs run coilovers with TF long arm kits. I spoke to TF tech a couple days ago and asked them quite frankly about running coilovers with their Long Arm system. They were pretty enthusiastic about it. I got into specifics about Coilovers and travel lengths bushings, etc with them. They specifically said not to exceed 14" CO's. They said the joints and bushings would wear out quicker (DUH) and that you would potentially begin to run into drive line issues and bind. Since I'm running 12" CO's and even if I have the newer bracket that allows for 14inches of travel, I'm within their recommended max guidelines. So I don't feel the 'extreme build' or 'that amount of flex' nature of the CO addition is a majority factor here or any subsequent break and quite frankly should stop being marketed in the community as a shortcoming.

To reinforce the above, the travel from the original packaged Teraflex 9550 shocks with my TF LA 6" lift comes in at 12.37 inches in the front and 12.84 inches in the back. That's just a tad longer than my 12inch coilovers.

I really wanted to square that away as there are many impressionable JK owners that are new to wheeling and lift kits on this site.


Along with my three Monster front track bars I've snapped, I've broken one of my rear Teraflex long arm frame side control arm brackets. On my fronts, I welded all along the outer perimeter of the bracket you posted in the second pic. Instead of my front one snapping like the pics you posted, it was getting cracks along the mount tab for the upper arm. It never broke, but I cut it off and replaced it. All 4 of them actually. front and rear. Here are pics of my broken rear.

We can call out their rear upper control arm bracket failures as a short coming of the lift, but they remedied it and now it's a standard part of their lift kit as I would expect a lift manufacture to do. Word on the street is that EVO(or hearsay as classified here) had problem's with busted front control arms with their Long Arm kits early on, they fixed the issue and incorporated into future builds as they should. To me, that's most important thing when it comes to this, fixing the issue. I've worked in the technology field for over 14 years now, one thing that is (sometimes painfully) obvious is that solutions and products get revised and reworked as more data and customer feedback comes in. It's a basic resultant that carries across just about anything product oriented. Perhaps it's an expectations thing.

Not discounting EVO's product whatsoever, but this site/brand really seems to be a marketing arm for them, so I thought I would use them as an example that no one is immune. I'd be running the EVO Long Arm kit had it been out at the time I installed mine. I'm sure just about every lift manufacture has run into issues with their JK products at one time or another. I know Skyjacker did on their early kits with their trackbar mounts included in their lift kits. Why? because I had a skyjacker lift kit w/trackbar bracket and it sheered off the axle while I was driving home from work. Called them up, they said it was a known issue and they have a newly designed bracket to replace it with. Done. Sure I was pissed deep in the middle of it limping my Jeep to a shop to get a weld repair on the bracket. But I was satisfied with the fact they were addressing it. To me, that's what happens with gen1 or early gen developed products.



The moral of the story is to inspect your rig routinely. I know I would have seen my failing weld issue sooner if I was more meticulous with my inspections.
 

wayoflife

Administrator
Staff member
Many, MANY rigs run coilovers with TF long arm kits. I spoke to TF tech a couple days ago and asked them quite frankly about running coilovers with their Long Arm system. They were pretty enthusiastic about it. I got into specifics about Coilovers and travel lengths bushings, etc with them. They specifically said not to exceed 14" CO's. They said the joints and bushings would wear out quicker (DUH) and that you would potentially begin to run into drive line issues and bind. Since I'm running 12" CO's and even if I have the newer bracket that allows for 14inches of travel, I'm within their recommended max guidelines. So I don't feel the 'extreme build' or 'that amount of flex' nature of the CO addition is a majority factor here or any subsequent break and quite frankly should stop being marketed in the community as a shortcoming.

:cheesy: You sure do like calling TeraFlex and have them tell you exactly what you want to hear. And really, who am I to argue with that. Me, I can only tell people like you what I have seen, not only on your Jeep but on many many other Jeeps running TeraFlex long arms as well. Fact of the matter is, they blow out bushings ALL THE TIME and especially so if you run coil overs. They have broken control arm mounts many many times as well and, truth be told, the same can be said about other long arm kits that run similar joint setups like Full Traction. I simply cannot make this stuff up nor would I have a need to. It's just a fact but, you can choose to believe whatever it is you want to believe.

To reinforce the above, the travel from the original packaged Teraflex 9550 shocks with my TF LA 6" lift comes in at 12.37 inches in the front and 12.84 inches in the back. That's just a tad longer than my 12inch coilovers. I really wanted to square that away as there are many impressionable JK owners that are new to wheeling and lift kits on this site.

:cheesy: Ummm, you'll forgive me but, just because a shock measures 12.37" or 12.84" DOES NOT mean that you get 12.37" or 12.84" of travel. If you really believe that, you should ask yourself why you bothered to buy a double throw down. You need to step back and realize that TeraFlex is in the business of selling you their products - it's their job. I just wanted to square that away as there are many impressionable JK owners that are new to wheeling and lift kits on this site. :naw:

We can call out their rear upper control arm bracket failures as a short coming of the lift, but they remedied it and now it's a standard part of their lift kit as I would expect a lift manufacture to do. Word on the street is that EVO(or hearsay as classified here) had problem's with busted front control arms with their Long Arm kits early on, they fixed the issue and incorporated into future builds as they should.

I can post up photos and back everything I say with facts and PROOF and the best you can offer is word on the street. :naw: By the way, how's that new track bar I told you to get from TeraFlex. You're welcome for that bit of info too :naw:

To me, that's most important thing when it comes to this, fixing the issue. I've worked in the technology field for over 14 years now, one thing that is (sometimes painfully) obvious is that solutions and products get revised and reworked as more data and customer feedback comes in. It's a basic resultant that carries across just about anything product oriented. Perhaps it's an expectations thing.

And I agree. And, in the case of their long arm brackets, they didn't offer to fix anything until the breaks became near epidemic. Up until then, they BLAMED the customers. From what I understand, they still aren't going to fix their rear tire carrier bracket and that's a safety issue.

Not discounting EVO's product whatsoever, but this site/brand really seems to be a marketing arm for them, so I thought I would use them as an example that no one is immune.

:cheesy: Oh I get it, you can share your opinion here but if myself or any other member of this forum shares theirs, we are somehow the "marketing arm" for EVO. Spoken like a true fanboy :naw:

I'm sure just about every lift manufacture has run into issues with their JK products at one time or another. I know Skyjacker did on their early kits with their trackbar mounts included in their lift kits. Why? because I had a skyjacker lift kit w/trackbar bracket and it sheered off the axle while I was driving home from work. Called them up, they said it was a known issue and they have a newly designed bracket to replace it with. Done. Sure I was pissed deep in the middle of it limping my Jeep to a shop to get a weld repair on the bracket. But I was satisfied with the fact they were addressing it. To me, that's what happens with gen1 or early gen developed products.

:cheesy: Sorry but, Skyjacker isn't exactly known for making quality products. Just because you make it a habbit to buy products that tend to be poorly designed doesn't mean that every lift manufacturer runs into issue like this.

The moral of the story is to inspect your rig routinely. I know I would have seen my failing weld issue sooner if I was more meticulous with my inspections.

Funny, that's pretty much what I said from the very beginning. :naw:
 

LoPo

Caught the Bug
:cheesy: You sure do like calling TeraFlex and have them tell you exactly what you want to hear. And really, who am I to argue with that. Me, I can only tell people like you what I have seen, not only on your Jeep but on many many other Jeeps running TeraFlex long arms as well. Fact of the matter is, they blow out bushings ALL THE TIME and especially so if you run coil overs. They have broken control arm mounts many many times as well and, truth be told, the same can be said about other long arm kits that run similar joint setups like Full Traction. I simply cannot make this stuff up nor would I have a need to. It's just a fact but, you can choose to believe whatever it is you want to believe.

They told me what I wanted to hear? I simply asked them if I was going to run coilovers with their LA kit, what is the max travel CO I should look at and why? Not sure how that's them telling me what I want to hear.

:cheesy: Ummm, you'll forgive me but, just because a shock measures 12.37" or 12.84" DOES NOT mean that you get 12.37" or 12.84" of travel. You need to step back and realize that TeraFlex is in the business of selling you their products - it's their job. I just wanted to square that away as there are many impressionable JK owners that are new to wheeling and lift kits on this site. :naw:

So if I ask what the travel length of a particular shock is and I receive lengths, that's TF is selling me something? :thinking: If I wasn't getting the stated amount of travel, please explain why. Trust me I understand about mounting positions. But please explain why that shock in the OEM location isn't providing spec'd travel. I can pretty much guarantee you that I am in the rear end of my Jeep currently. Given that TF stated a 14"CO is fine with their lifts, I still don't understand how there is a problem with max travel of the EVO CO's that I have installed when combined with the TF LA.

Word on the street is that EVO(or hearsay as classified here) had problem's with busted front control arms with their Long Arm kits early on, they fixed the issue and incorporated into future builds as they should.
I can post up photos and back everything I say with facts and PROOF and the best you can offer is word on the street. :naw:
Please, I'd love to hear the details of the break, photos, and remediation. :thumb:

By the way, how's that new track bar I told you to get from TeraFlex. You're welcome for that bit of info too :naw:

I thanked you in our PM for reviewing my question and the pic I sent. :yup: Is there something more you wanted out of it?

And I agree. And, in the case of their long arm brackets, they didn't offer to fix anything until the breaks became near epidemic. Up until then, they BLAMED the customers.

Sort of like EVO did when a customer's coilover tower broke, they blamed the bumpstop install?

:cheesy: Oh I get it, you can share your opinion here but if myself or any other member of this forum shares theirs, we are somehow the "marketing arm" for EVO. Spoken like a true fanboy :naw:

Not exactly...but it seems I can't share my opinion or anyone else for that matter when it differs from yours... because "you know from experience". The only major products that get touted around here are EVO and that's what the vast majority of your videos are about. When a competing product is mentioned, it's usually squashed with 'Hey, that's my experience'. Not everyone is looking for Eddie's experience on every subject, thus having a community to provide input.

I'd love to hear what the definition of 'fanboy' means to you.... in most cases that I've heard it used in the past 10 years, its been to describe a fanatical person standing behind a single particular brand or product. Pretty sure that doesn't describe me. The Teraflex lift kit just happens to be the kit I have installed. Given the vast options at this point compared to when I purchased / installed and what my friends run, I'd have a much harder decision between Rock Krawler, EVO, and GenRight. Lot's of great options out there to consider beyond that list too.

:cheesy: Sorry but, Skyjacker isn't exactly known for making quality products. Just because you make it a habbit to buy products that tend to be poorly designed doesn't mean that every lift manufacturer runs into issue like this.

:cheesy: Actually I didn't buy the SkyJacker lift. The previous owner had it installed on the Jeep when I bought the Jeep from them in 2007. :yup: But thanks for the compliment on my perceived decision making ability! :thumb:

What other products have I purchased that have been poorly designed?

Didn't you run TF Shorts arms on Moby, then FT, now EVO? You seem to think TF is bad and stated FT is bad, so it seems you're actually ahead of me in the 'purchasing of poorly designed products' category. I mean, I wish I had that kind of money to replace lift kits every couple of years, but I don't.


Funny, that's pretty much what I said from the very beginning. :naw:

...and I agree. I take blame for missing the weld that was coming off the frame.
 

wayoflife

Administrator
Staff member
They told me what I wanted to hear? I simply asked them if I was going to run coilovers with their LA kit, what is the max travel CO I should look at and why? Not sure how that's them telling me what I want to hear.

Again, you asked them what is the max travel CO I should look at and why and they told you what you wanted to hear, that you would be fine with what you got. What else would they tell you being that you already have their kit. The real question that you should have asked is how would they even know? :naw:

So if I ask what the travel length of a particular shock is and I receive lengths, that's TF is selling me something? :thinking: If I wasn't getting the stated amount of travel, please explain why. Trust me I understand about mounting positions. But please explain why that shock in the OEM location isn't providing spec'd travel. I can pretty much guarantee you that I am in the rear end of my Jeep currently. Given that TF stated a 14"CO is fine with their lifts, I still don't understand how there is a problem with max travel of the EVO CO's that I have installed when combined with the TF LA.

You'll forgive me if I don't trust what you know because you don't sound like you know a whole lot about anything other than what you're sold on. As far as travel goes, you've clearly never taken ride height into account or how that might effect the amount of droop you get and you've clearly never taken bump stops into account or how that will effect the amount of stuff you have. You say you can "guarantee" me that you are getting full travel out of your rear and I'd like to cash in on it and have you prove it. I'd also like to know just how much droop you're getting (from ride height) as that's where you really start to see things go.

Please, I'd love to hear the details of the break, photos, and remediation. :thumb:

Ummm, I did, pics of your break are on the very first post. Highoctane has come in with more from his Jeep. Where are your details, pics and remediation? Oh, that's right, you can only gossip about what you heard on the street :naw:

I thanked you in our PM for reviewing my question and the pic I sent. :yup: Is there something more you wanted out of it?

Funny, I just looked and all you said was "Teraflex is sending me the new one, I just had to cover shipping. $15." Of course, you would never have even known about their weak track bar or how to get a new one for the cost of shipping had it not been for me. No matter, I understand that you've been busy looking for a way to defend your beloved TeraFlex :naw:

Sort of like EVO did when a customer's coilover tower broke, they blamed the bumpstop install?

:cheesy: Dick Lika, yeah, I heard about his break. Did you know he used to have an EVO Lever too and that both were installed by Rebel Off Road? Not like they wouldn't have a motive to try and make EVO look bad. And, not that it matters but, EVO did try to bend over backwards to fix and replace everything, labor included on their dime but Dick never took them up on that. That's a big chunk of change they were ready to fork out and he wouldn't even of had to pay $15 for shipping. I wonder why he would turn them down? :rolleyes2:

Not exactly...but it seems I can't share my opinion or anyone else for that matter when it differs from yours... because "you know from experience".

Oh brother. You know, the facts I share are based on experience and just because that often times trumps your opinion doesn't mean that anyone here has been preventing you from sharing it anyway. :naw:

The only major products that get touted around here are EVO and that's what the vast majority of your videos are about. When a competing product is mentioned, it's usually squashed with 'Hey, that's my experience'. Not everyone is looking for Eddie's experience on every subject, thus having a community to provide input.

Last I checked, this is a free country and if you don't like what you hear here, nobody is making you listen to it. Yeah, you bet a lot of our videos feature EVO products because that's what's on our Jeeps now. In spite of what you choose to believe, that hasn't always been the case. In fact, I've been lucky enough to have installed, tested and personally run a myriad of lift kits, suspension components, of different makes and different lift heights over the past 6+ years and have documented most of it and I would hope that I would have learned something from all that by now. If you don't want to hear about what I've learned from my experiences, by all means, give TeraFlex a call and allow them to sell you more stuff.

I'd love to hear what the definition of 'fanboy' means to you.... in most cases that I've heard it used in the past 10 years, its been to describe a fanatical person standing behind a single particular brand or product. Pretty sure that doesn't describe me.

My definition is someone who gets their panties in a wad if they think someone is speaking negatively about a product they've chosen to buy. They will go out of their way to defend the company in question, to no end and attack those who had dared to speak ill about them even if it's backed up with facts, photos and proof. That pretty much describes to you to a tee.

The Teraflex lift kit just happens to be the kit I have installed. Given the vast options at this point compared to when I purchased / installed and what my friends run, I'd have a much harder decision between Rock Krawler, EVO, and GenRight. Lot's of great options out there to consider beyond that list too.

And nobody is asking you not like what you have or to not not get anything other than EVO. It's your money and you should spend it on whatever it is you want.

:cheesy: Actually I didn't buy the SkyJacker lift. The previous owner had it installed on the Jeep when I bought the Jeep from them in 2007. :yup: But thanks for the compliment on my perceived decision making ability! :thumb:

Ummm, not exactly. :naw: I was simply questioning your judgement to try and compare Skyjacker quality with other companies. Yes, they share about the same quality as TeraFlex but, that about it.

Didn't you run TF Shorts arms on Moby, then FT, now EVO? You seem to think TF is bad and stated FT is bad, so it seems you're actually ahead of me in the 'purchasing of poorly designed products' category. I mean, I wish I had that kind of money to replace lift kits every couple of years, but I don't.

You're right, I have installed, worked on and/or personally run most of the TeraFlex kits available today. The same can be said about Full-Traction, Currie, Rock Krawler, Rubicon Express, Rough Country, Clayton and more. This is why I have experience and you just have opinions. Having said that, I never said that TeraFlex or Full Traction was "bad" - just that I haven't seen them handle coil overs very well. But, you can believe what you want to believe.

...and I agree. I take blame for missing the weld that was coming off the frame.

For the record, you didn't even see it after it broke. I had to point it out to you. :naw:
 
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